End the Blame Game

Is Your Marriage Worth Saving?

Sometimes people think I am against divorce or separation, but really that isn’t true. I don’t think anyone has an obligation to stay in an abusive marriage. If you want to get out and you can do that safely and without causing the abuse to escalate, then certainly I think you should do so.

What I do believe however is that divorce isn’t the easy option people pretend it to be, and can be a much harder road to end the conflict and return to a place where you start growing again as a person.

My father was in general practice as a medical doctor for over 50 years of his life and in that time learned a lot about people. His advice to me was that divorce is ALWAYS a major set back. He taught me that people often see their partner as a burden – and believe they can run faster on their own – when in reality this doesn’t turn out to be the truth.

Sure if your life is headed in the wrong direction and you cannot get on course together towards someplace you want to be in the future, sometimes taking a few steps back is necessary (somewhat like pruning a tree) but the setback still needs to be acknowledged, and real care taken if you do decide to leave.

Whichever way you choose I want to continue to support you, and if you haven’t got our ebooks yet encourage you to purchase them today.

Our introductory specials will give you the opportunity to buy our program at a discount and you will be offered these specials when you subscribe to our site here:

Narcissistic Personality Disorder in Your Partner

Please take your time and read through the private pages you will be lead through once you subscribe.

This is not an easy problem to tackle and you need to take this seriously and one step at a time;

Narcissistic Personality Disorder in Your Partner

I recommend our Introductory special number one and two to get started and then later when you are ready to do more work on yourself – Introductory special number three.

These ebooks will cost you less than a night out and will provide you step by step with the help you need whether you want to stay and work on your marriage or if you decide you want to leave.

If you are having trouble because your credit card is maxed out or you do not want your partner to know you are purchasing our material – please contact us by replying to one of the emails you will receive (after you subscribe) and someone will assist you (probably Steve!). Please do not let anything stand in the way of you getting the help and advice you need.

Back when I needed the advice I offer I was really in a terrible corner and there was no one online like us to help. I know some people criticise us but really we have given all of our lives these past 5 years to helping people out of the same corner I had found myself in back then. Google has over this time made it harder and harder for people to find us and instead on the front page when you search Google for Narcissistic Personality Disorder you will either find people selling ebooks on vibrational healing or people saying there is no hope.

I do not think either of these are valid responses to this serious issue and I believe that instead our site should be getting better exposure than Google gives us – but I cannot hit my head against that brick wall any longer. So now I am being forced to do more off-line work approaching Government agencies and Universities, in the hope that they can help get our program to more families without us going broke on advertising.

One way or another I am still determined to get this message out, while continuing to support everyone here the best I can.

Towards this we will hopefully have a proper forum set up here soon.

This is a small but very precious community that comments on this site and I hope that while I go out searching for new avenues to promote our message you will all help me keep the conversation alive.

Hang in there and please don’t ever lose hope. You are fighting for your own (and your children if you have them) right to be loved and respected. But what is your partner fighting for? In the end it really a matter of whose will is stronger and I believe the greater strength can be yours (-:

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There Are 65 Brilliant Comments

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  1. babyseal says:

    all to late now im divorced

    • Kim Cooper says:

      Hi babyseal – I feel for you and hope you are okay. Our material is also about healing and understanding what went wrong. There are a lot or people here in the same situation you are.

  2. Colin says:

    Hi Guys,

    I have been on your mailing list for a while now. I suspect both me and my wife have narcissistic traits and in my opinion codependency issues. We are both committed Christians too. I left my wife in Latvia 5 months ago as it got too much for me. I camne back to the UK. My wife has now decided she wants a divorce. We have only been married 3 years. I was happy to return and get help for our marriage but she just ants a quick divorce and move on. I have not agreed to this yet. Financially this has caused huge problems too. Any advice – I know I should keep letting go and giving her to God which I do, He gives me His peace, but maybe I should take some action, just don’t know what? I have recognised I haven’t got a clue how to be married – grew up in a violent alcoholic household – she had an alcoholic father and first husband and brother. this is a real mess but i can’t help feeling that divorce is not the answer.

    • Kim Cooper says:

      Hi Colin, I really feel for you but it is very hard if she is determined that a divorce is the only answer. One way you may break down her resistance is to start agreeing with everything she says – even about wanting a divorce. You can say something like “Yes I feel very sad about it but you are probably right.” If you can keep doing this you will soon find out if she is truly serious about the divorce or just being rebellious. That is the only thing that might make her change her mind.

  3. Lois ( Korrie) says:

    Kim, I was not married to him but Loved every hair on his head, until…. yup I got into the “pull me back, get me nutty again” syndrome. I never learned how to handle him but got out of it simply because it triggered too many past events in my life that I needed to put behind me so I could go on and finish my RN. I get very sad wondering if He will ever get help, but that is my problem, I need to focus on my healing now.

    Thank you for all you work and sharing on this subject, I just wished I found you before the chunks came out of me and he went on dancing….well, I do not know for sure but I pray for him and his daughter. God Bless!

  4. Sonya Mullins says:

    I tried to save my marriage. We started getting counseling and I found out that my husband was not only a Narcissist but he also had paranoid scizophenia. His dad also had it. The abuse was so terrible. He started accusing me of cheating with every male I came in contact with. He started telling my friends at the church were I had been attending years before I met him that I was cheating on him. He filed for divorce because he was so convinced. He said he wasn’t having an open marriage. I did everyhing I could to reason with him and so did the marriage counselor. He just twisted everything around. He said I told him God was going to kill him. I wanted my marriage to work so bad and now I just need to heal. It is a tragedy because of he illness was telling him lies and there was no getting through to him. I tried so hard to get him to get on the right meds and he just wouldn’t listen.

    • Kim Cooper says:

      Hi Sonya, I really feel for you – it is so sad you could not get him to get help. I have seen that a few times now that once the narcissistic defence comes down underneath can be other mental health issues such as schizophrenia.

  5. Day by Day says:

    Kim – I believe in what you and Steve are doing (you and your materials have changed my own life), so please continue to “fight the fight” to get your message out to more people!! Hang in there!!

  6. Paula says:

    Yes Kim, the words “Don’t ever lose hope” are so important – even if it doesn’t work out for the couple being able to stay together in the end.

    What you and Steve have done and continue to do is very much worthwhile Kim! You have helped so many people survive the trauma of abuse within marriage and even out of it (as is now my case).

    Unfortunately, no matter how hard I tried, my husband’s false pride was too much to conquer, and I couldn’t help but react strongly when he vilely insulted me. He could be viciously emotionally cruel at times, yet so loving at other times, and also like a lost little boy. I used to mother him when he was like this and comfort and cry with him. I loved him SO MUCH! But I was drinking more heavily in the end to self-soothe, then became very ill. I no longer drink (otherwise I’d be dead). Yes, I was so co-dependant Kim, but thanks to you have learnt to become much stronger, but my doctor insisted that I must finish the marriage due to my ill-health and the risks of further harm. It’s been extremely painful having to detatch (for both of us)and I’m still trying to go through settlement. Neither of us are young. But this feels like it’s the right thing to do. My husband was jealous of my family, and one night he told me his family HATED me. Oh God, that was so hurtful!! I’ve been through the threats of suicide stage, the calling Police, the threats that he would like to strangle me etc. etc. Now from a distance, he seems to be accepting (is “sharing” with his ex-wife) and I treat him as amicably as I can – anything to avoid conflict.

    Now I am caring for my elderly mother – who can be a little controlling and has been a bit critical of me also but overall is a wonderful loving support. Have learnt so much in such a short time, and I’m amazed I’m still coping with all these pressures. Honestly Kim, if not for you and Steve I would never have survived all this – the knowledge of the characteristics and how to deal with Narcissism or Borderline Personality Disorder which you have provided me via your ebooks and on-lone (and so many others)have been a Godsend!! Thank you so very much for helping me HANG IN THERE!!

    Sincerely,
    Paula

  7. Paula says:

    Oops I meant “on-line”…

    Kim, I forget to say that during the gradual ending of my marriage when my husband was making suicidal threats (so frightening and upsetting) he said one night in a very convincing way “There’s no hope…” I kept telling him there was ALWAYS Hope, and to think of his (adult) children and little grandchildren who’s little hearts would break if they lost their Pop. Of course he cried. I also told him that I did love him, and that I would never stop loving him, but it was just that we couldn’t live together. (maybe this could be helpful to anyone in a similar situation if they can’t see things through like me) It did seem to settle him, after he cried and I hugged him and cried with him. Actually, I’m sure I’ve cried and grieved for him more than I have for myself, and I’m crying again now… God help him! He was not responsible for the traumatic childhood that he had to deal with.

  8. becky says:

    I had hoped to save my marrigae but my husband will not face that he needs to mature and change. I have spent the last 5 years growing and evolving and learning that I am not responsible for his behavior. After leaving him several times, I have had to stop the madness and turn completely away from him. He is so abusive, on drugs, and I have caught him several times having on-line affairs and soliciting prostitutes. It is painful to live that way. Even when he is caught red handed, he denies it and the abuse gets worse. He even has to punish me for finding out about his secret life. I do see that my own co-depencey made it worse for me and I have moved on to heal from this vicious cycle of abuse. I pray for my husband everyday. He has caused us to loose everything thru his addictions. He is a con artist, by the time you figure out what he has done, everthing is lost. I am just focussing on God and moving on. My husband has yet to say he is sorry. It is all my fault, the kids fault, his parents fault. He is a sick person. While I feel sorry for him, I have learned that I cannot loose my life for him.

  9. Neil says:

    Keep up the good work guys and hopefully Google will get it right for you.

    It may be worth talking to a Google rep. about the quality information you supply to desperate people with examples of testimonies and a list of contact phone numbers, and they may well do a manual review of your site and re-rank it back at the top.

    I would certainly try it.

  10. becky says:

    Paula, I feel your pain. We are also older and have grown children and grandkids. I feel so bad for my grandchildren. They are confused as to why we are not together. I have come to realize that my husband is addicited to his disorder. He gets high off of his behavior just like drugs. I also almost drank myself to death just to be numb. I stopped drinking! I take responsibility for my behavior and have asked my kids to forgive me for hurting them and allowing him to hurt them. We are all just tolerating him at a safe and healthy distance. It is so sad. He just refuses to accept that he needs to change. Because if he does so, he will have to give up his secret lifestyle of drugs, porn, hookers, gambling, etc. He is 50 years old and worse today that he was at 35. Which led me to realize that this is not going to change. Atleast not on my watch.

  11. Rosalind says:

    Very good advice on this topic. Having survived a difficult divorce, I can attest that my own experience was as you and your father described. Many thanks for your excellent site and books which I have read and learned a great deal from. Any help and advice you could provide to those who have gone through divorce, particularly in regard to learning to trust again and getting back to a place of growth, would be very beneficial to me and many of your other readers, I am sure.

    • Kim Cooper says:

      Thanks Rosalind and I am sorry to hear that your divorce was so difficult. And yes I will think about that as an idea for a book – it is a good suggestion.

  12. carol says:

    Becky, I am going through a similar situation, my 51yr old husband informed me he has been with prostitutes for 15 of our 20yr marriage and thought he had HIV. He does not have HIV and i filed for divorce, now we are in joint counseling and I cannot take any more pain of hearing that I am a terrible person and crap in bed. I have been self soothing and it helps. He has anger issues and he is in counseling. I am stronger now than ever and will not settle for what I had with him. My kids deserve more and so do I. I felt bad for him and have tried some of the skills Kim has suggested, but I know in my gut that he has to change and he has not taken responsibility. So I must save myself.

  13. RT says:

    I’m not sure what search terms I used, but I found you guys right away. That was many months ago. However, I wanted to leave so I didn’t buy or really read any of your materials/articles. Later in my journey, I came to understand that your approach was exactly what I needed! I was just too stubborn(and too hurt) to see that. But now, as I am trying to implement all 13 steps (in Back from the Looking Glass) I understand more and more that IF your husband is reasonable and at all open to change then your way (what is called “Love-Intelligence” in a book called Whole Child, Whole Parent)is the only way. We are doing soooo much better and he feels he can make these changes because I am so much more SAFE to change in front of. You two have blessed us and that’s not something I don’t say lightly. Please share your ideas with as many people as you can. Love is always the only way- even if that means leaving. In my case, we are gonna make it and we couldn’t be more joyful about our mutual healing! Love, RT
    PS I am one of those that Steve helped to get the book when I needed to hide that I was getting help and I thank you both so much for taking a chance on us.

  14. SixtiesChick says:

    Over 45 years married to a narcissist…wished I had divorced him years ago. Now I am “tied” to him for financial reasons. To anyone that is young enough to start a healthy life (no narcissist). DO IT! Just my thoughts….

  15. RT says:

    Another P.S. from me…I thought to tell you that I believe I also first heard of your site on Out of the Fog, a site for people dealing with spouse/family members with Borderline Personality Disorder. Just now googled it and found it again. Here it is: http://outofthefog.net/forum/index.php topic=4518.0
    A woman named DiversifiedDebbie, 4 entries down recommends your work. As I began to do research on what I was dealing with, I came across a few of those comments criticising your site. That just made me what to look into it myself! Often great ideas are discounted at first! Look at Galileo. And this was very true of your ideas. :)

  16. Melanie Jean Mayfield says:

    My husband of 21 years has Asperger’s Syndrome, which includes Narcissism, Oppositional Defiant Disorder, alcoholism, abuse of meds, and countless other negative symptoms. We had split up and got back together. [He said he quit drinking, etc. He LIED.]

    The last straw was when he picked a fight with me for the b’Zillionth time. I fought back, he called the cops, and I got thrown in jail. [I bailed out in 3 days.] Result: court fees, fines, community service, 1 year of domestic violence classes, and 3 years probation. I’M paying for HIS crime! [He also promised to give me half of an insurance settlement when he got hit by a car on his bike last year. That was yet another lie. He never keeps his promises. Now he's blown all his money and "invested" a good deal of it on thieves.] His favorite game is to start trouble- with me, the neighbors, or whoever- and call the cops on them. The cops know his record. Once he even cursed and threatened a 911 operator because she wouldn’t play his game. He got a ticket and went to court, but he never went to jail for it. The cop [deputy] who arrested me was knowingly helping my husband abuse me. There is no “justice”. I no longer have any respect for “the law”. The system is corrupt. I finally have my own place now- not that I can afford it, but- I can’t live with someone who abuses me and calls the cops on me. If I fight back again, I’ll do serious jail time because I have a “prior offense”- even though I’m innocent. I’d rather commit suicide than go to jail.

    • Kim Cooper says:

      Hi Melanie – There are smarter ways to fight back that won’t get you in trouble. You know his routine and so if you start playing this to win you really can outsmart him. Being able to keep cool when he provokes you is the most important first step. Then his game can’t work. You also need to be very savvy when you deal with the police – because you are right – if you are not careful they can become abusers themselves. There is a lot on that in Back From the Looking Glass.

  17. Mary Lee says:

    For many of us, by the time we finally figure out what is going on, we are well into raising our families and there are no better alternatives: not really, not when you consider the setback that divorce actually is. My husband and I have been married for 47 years. Because I was set up by my father’s abusive treatment of me as a child, I married a man who took up the abuse where my father left off. He acted great during courtship, but as soon as we got married, everything changed.

    The hardest task was learning the difference between what I can fix in myself and what I can properly take responsibility for, as opposed to what is not my fault and not my responsibility. I had to learn what is about me and what is not about me. I had to develop a very strong confidence about this in the face of my spouse’s actual belief that everything is my fault and I am responsible for everything. He has blamed me for every little thing he didn’t like in his life, and he has a very low frustration level and a very low tolerance for things not going his way. I had to learn to recognize when he is being manipulative; when he is playing games; when he is expecting things from me that I cannot deliver—even things that no human being can deliver. When he’s acting this way (he cycles through better times and worse times), confidence can fade fast so it has to be very strong so I can hang on to it. As my confidence grew over the years, and I saw that I had to develop an emotionally safe distance between us, he began to complain that I didn’t love him—blaming me for that, too.

    My bottom line for some time now has been that I am committed to behaving in a loving and kind way to my spouse no matter how I feel, and I expect the same behavior from him towards me. When I don’t get that behavior from him, I am going to say something to him about that—I’m going to give him the message that a boundary has been crossed, this isn’t working for me, and I expect better from him. If his behavior remains livable for me, then fine. We can still play our roles as mom and dad and have the family life we both see as important. But if his behavior towards me deteriorates again to unloving, blaming, and angry then we have a problem and I will decide what I need to do about that.

    I’m not going to let him badger me into either saying what he wants to hear or not saying what he doesn’t want to hear. I’m going to speak my truth–in love, I hope, but my truth nonetheless. And I will feel how I feel. And I’m not going to lie about that. So we shall see how he adjusts, because his reality and mine are still miles apart. His reality still looks a lot like insanity to me much of the time.

  18. Mary Lee says:

    I tried to find you on Google, Kim, and you are right: it doesn’t come up any more. So sorry, but so glad I found you when I did.

  19. Margie says:

    Kim & Steve, I believe the work you are doing is wonderful. You have really got the word out about narcissism.
    While you have been able to help a great many couples, there are just some marriages like mine that seeem to be beyond help.
    I have been married for more than 43 years. These were years of heart break. The harder I tried to pull our marriage together the more my husband ran in the opposite direction.
    Wish you had of been around 40 years ago, telling me all the things I was doing wrong.

    I can put a check mark on every indicator that he is an narcissit. He has every one of them.
    I stayed because I never gave up hope that one day he would change. But the change didn’t come, if anything he got worse as the years went by.
    I was left out and am still left out of all his plans and he goes around by himself and lets me know what a great time he is having. The money was always for big ticket items for himsel( mostly cars ).
    He spent and still spends most of his free time at his mother’s house. I began to see this was his hide out.
    I was left to look after the children by myself and handle their problems when they were young. Now that they are grown up, he is still doing the same routine.
    He is so into himself, you cannot make any progress with any of the information you give out to try to help those married to a narcissit.
    Unfortunately I think it was just to late when I found your web site. He had been doing this behaviour and getting away with it for way too long.
    I have been in bad health for the last 15 years.
    Exhausted adreanal glands brought on many more health problems..
    If I was well I am pretty sure I would not be here with him now.There are times that I feel like I am just hanging on by a thread.
    The one good thing I have learned from your site ..is how to self sooth. If I can’t fix our mariage at least I can work on staying sane.
    Because believe me, even on my worst days, he hasn’t an ounze of sympathy for me.

    Keep up the good work. I am sure there are lots of younger couples who are going to benefit from your expert advice.

    • Kim Cooper says:

      Hi Margie, Your husband sounds just like my father in law and he sure is a tough case! Being chronically ill is a big part of codependence. You may not be able to change him but I believe tackling your own codependence can help you get well. Hang in there!

  20. lisa says:

    I am married to a narcissist, have been for 10 years. No kids. A week ago this past Saturday he slammed my head into a wall.i have tried to save this relationship. Last time he took steps and we started counseling. She told me he wasn’t a narcissist.i told her he was…he is textbook. She also told me I should try not to anger him. Ya think? I’ve had a therapist for 12 years and she’s amazing. She told me about his narcissism just from what I’ve told her. I did my own research and found out a great deal. My life has been consumed by tiptoeing around and trying to stay one step ahead of him. It’s exhausting! I decided that I will be leaving within the month.

    • Kim Cooper says:

      Hi Lisa – I understand your decision completely – but you need to be very careful. People with narcissistic tendencies often have abandonment issues and even though it might seem like they are asking for it – you leaving can actually trigger the abuse to get much worse. I strongly recommend you work through the steps throughout and especially at the end of Back from the Looking Glass to help de escalate the hostility and violence and allow you to make a clean break.

  21. Kim keep up the good work! I love everything you write and sometimes feel like you are talking directly to me. I have been married for 34 years and found out about this when his mother died. He revealed he was abuse as a child and I researched online to find you and Steve. It is refreshing to know that there are others out there. My two sons(19 and 31) also have this NPD and I have taken abuse from all 3 at one time or another. Thanks for giving me the courage to go on because now they know what they have been doing and have more control over their anger issues. Check out my website which was inspired by you.

  22. Your place is valueble for me. Thanks!…

  23. leanna says:

    hi kim i found your site a while ago, even tho i havn’t been able to get your books, your articals and emails and even your readers have made me feel like i’m not alone. we have only been married 3 years which have been the hardest years of my life and even though i love my husband i dont know how much strength i have left
    when we got married i was 20 and so madly in love i didn’t see how manipulating he was, when our kids came along he just got worse and now every fight is all my fault every thing that goes wrong is my fault. i’m only 23 but my heart feels much older and i’m so lost as to what to do now i would try anything. i cant tell anymore what is my fault and whats not. we just cant let my kids grow in this family thinking daddy’s behavior is ok. i want to help our marrage but i dont know what to do.

    • Kim Cooper says:

      Hi Leanne, Please respond to the email you got telling you about this post and someone will help you get the books. You really need to start working through the steps and exercises.

  24. Rebecca says:

    Hi Kim,
    I am so sorry to hear that Google is pushing you out. I don’t understand fully what the problem is, but perhaps they have a bit of NPD going on :)
    I have been dating a man for 4 years now, and when I first started reading your materials I thought it sounded like what I was experiencing with my man. Just recently, his sister referred to his narcissistic tendencies and I was surprised that she non-chalantly mentioned it to me. He is a good man at heart and yet I tend to feel their is deceit underneath his motives. He is a first class arguer and i have tried to use your techniques with some degree of success. Many times he is very humble and accepts responsibility but I am in fear that when we get married he will drastically change. The part in your book about the gaps is really confusing to me, but I believe it would help me to understand not only him, but myself much better. Do you have any suggestions on how I can work the “gaps” a little bit more?
    I appreciate your writing and your insight and I share these articles with a dear friend who, in my opinion, is married to a classic NPD ~ ego-maniac. She has gotten much comfort from your letters and blogs.
    Thank you, thank you, thank you.
    rebah

    • Kim Cooper says:

      Hi Rebah, The gap finder exercise is at the end of the Love Safety Net Workbook. There is an explanation in part one and the exercise itself is in part 2. This will help you find your own and your partners developmental gaps that will be causing stress. Working on filling these in is the path to real self esteem.

  25. Darlyn says:

    Hey Kim!

    Your blog is right on target once again. There was a time(many actually) where there was no light at the end of the tunnel for my marriage. I felt I had done and given everything I could possibly muster into saving my marriage and repairing it. I was a total mess, consciously and subconsciously. UNTIL I got your & Steve’s ebooks and other material.

    Through diligently working through the steps you have outlined there has been improvement within my marriage. And most importantly within ME. And that is what and where we/I need to start. With ourselves. My husband took notice of what I was doing for myself and soon followed suit(to a degree, still work in progress). ‘Because I love you, us, and our marriage-I’m learning to say NO’. And the other many teachings you offer in the ebooks.

    I no longer see seperation or divorce in our future, although if in time that is where it goes to, I know I won’t have those feelings of life coming to an end(a broken heart can be deadly).

    I myself will be personally taking your website address to some local organizations that could really use to learn about this disorder to be better able to help those in the community.

  26. Sixties.Chick says:

    It is very difficult for me to reflect on this; however, I share my story (in part) hoping others might benefit regarding their struggles with a narcissist.

    I met and married my husband within months. It was during the Viet Nam war. I left with him right after the wedding to spend six weeks together before he went overseas. He never set up any financial means for me while he served in the military that year. Instead he collected the money the military added to his check to party while abroad. (I had no idea regarding spousal support in the military.) He told me that his pay records were lost for that year. Of course, I believed. After he returned from overseas, I was told he was over paid when he came back and that they would be holding his paycheck. He would only be getting $50 a month until his discharge. I had no reason not to trust him. It was all lies. Of course being overseas, women and sex was a part of his party time.

    After, he returned he was very flirty with other women. So any friends we had began to drop us.

    After his time was up in the military, we moved to another state and he began working at his profession….and started his many affairs in our marriage.

    Things really hit rock bottom when he secured a job at a college. Being a very handsome young man, there were lots of affairs with college coeds. Even bought one of them a car!

    Fastforward….every job he has had there has always been “another woman”. Along with the cheating he was stealing from every company he worked for …even at the college. He kept us in financial misery most of the time. With everything he was doing there were lies and more lies in our marriage.

    He never had anything to do with our children. He always had a special room in the house where he spent his time at home. Our grown children would come for a visit. Go to ” his room”. Say
    “Hello” and return to give him a kiss and say goodby before they left.

    At one point in time, we got very active in religion. He seemed to have “settled down” trying to be a good christian. Later I found out he was stealing from the company he worked for and selling the goods the whole time. And yes there were women even during this time.

    He is now an old man. However, he is still the same. He can fool everyone with what a “good” person he is. He still uses that charm to lure the ladies and get lots of attention. All that has changed is that he is more obvious with what is going on.

    Many times in our marriage I believe it was better. But it wasn’t. It only appeared that way. I began to call our situation “loves me …loves me not”.

    I share a bit of my story in hopes others don’t wind up like me. Never let them fool you into thinking they’ve changed, settled down, blah, blah, blah. They are who they are. I always said my husband could only “be good” for so long. It’s great when it’s good. It’s just not worth all the pain!

    Take care of yourself. Make sure you have a “special” savings fund just for you. Some day you may want more out of life and would have the “means” to make that change.

    Wishing everyone only the best….

  27. Surrender to God says:

    Hi Kim ,
    your blogs and books have been very helpful and informative and i look forward each day to receiving helpful ideas to implement Thanks for all the good work and hours of hard work you are putting in to help so many people in need.
    Margie.s comments (no.19) has expressed most of what i have been through in my 41 years of marriage and 7 years of courtship. Initially he was very ardent and caring but even before marriage I realized ,he was lying and when confronted ,would deny it .I wanted to break off the relationship, but he would cry and promised to change .Almost immediately after marriage he changed into an angry ,uncaring and mean person,who did not want to have any physical or emotional contact with me .When asked as to why he had no interest all of a sudden ,he said he did not know ,himself, what the reason was and he asked me to leave him alone ,Initially with much reluctance he went to see a psychiatrist with me and kept blaming me for his lack of interest .The good outcome was i conceived ,but his emotional abuse increased and he had no sex for another 4 years and at my behest and persistence i conceived a second child but for the next 34 years he has no sex or any physical contact and his emotional abuse increased.I was frustrated and tense and unhappy and did not know what to make of this madness Whenever i tried to discuss the issue even lovingly ,he would start to yell and intimidate me saying don’t start that again or,would turn his back on me or leave the room banging the door shut behind him .He always had his way in everything and this also sadly affected our children in many ways .,so after putting through 15 years of this hell, I told him “unless things change ,i have seen a lawyer” when he shouted and said “are you trying to threaten me and mumbled that he would show me ” He is vindictive and i was in a state of disbelief and shock ,when he left an envelope on the sofa with several photos he had taken of him with a girl holding her close ,sleeping on her lap etc..When confronted ,he said it just happened There was no explanation or sorry .I told him ,i am going to my mother’s house with my children It was late at night but he said he was leaving and was away for a month .He would talk to the children take them out occasionally to eat and also to leave them to school daily i did not interact with him at all.The children would say dad cries and says he wants to come home, so i told him i would like to talk to him first He came home ,behaved as if all was ok and started leafing through the mail and would not talk .When i insisted i wanted to talk when he would not look up from the papers i tried put the paper aside, when he lashed out and slapped me hard .I was too stunned to speak ,but my daughter who was 11years at that time shouted and said “what are you doing dad “?,when he started to bang his head against the wall .when i tried to stop him from hurting himself .I do not know what to make of it
    When asked to leave later he did not and stayed on promising that he would be a dead man if it happens again.Later in 1986, I happened to come across a book “Men who hate women and the women who love them ” by Marjorie ORRS and first got to understand what the problem was. I lived on for another 25 years with the turmoil ,only to discover that he had been meeting the married girl with whom he had an affair earlier and was confronted by her husband who threatened him and my husband heartlessly told me he had slept with her and when i told him i had had enough he said he was willing to go for councelling .,which he did for some time ,but it did not help much .Then i came across your website and got my daughter to order back from the looking glass ,and the two workbooks and codependency and thanks to you it helped me to understand how to deal with the
    situation better but he takes every opportunity to
    take advantage to provoke me, when i am tired or vulnerable ,but i have been able to stop his yelling and abuse to a great extent .Still i feel cheated of so many years and long for love and understanding especially ,since i had lost my father at the age of 7 and missed out on a happy childhood and like you had a sister , who made it her mission to make me miserable .
    Kim i would be grateful if you can show me a way of letting him know how Narcissism and codependency have ruined and affected our lives .I wish i could get through to him as his false pride will not allow him to acknowledge his narcissism .I don’t mean to intrude ,but how were you able to make Steve aware of the same ? I wish i knew how .
    Thanks once again and i want to congratulate you on the excellent work ,both you and Steve are doing to help others .

    • Kim Cooper says:

      Hi Surrender to God,

      I left a webpage open on my computer and I said to Steve I have been reading something and I think it is about you. Of course that made him interested and so he went and read it. He came out looking pale later and just sat with us and watched TV and for about the first time ever was just quiet with us. Later of course all of his bad behaviour returned and the steps and exercises I offer in my books were what I did about it. That was how he first learned about narcissism however and then later when I wrote the books and they started selling he had to learn to talk about it (-:

  28. David says:

    What I found with my NPD girlfriend was her total inability to actually see her behaviour, I tried everything to bring it to her attention but in the end she is in absolute denial about it. I have since found out that she has been like this for decades, her brother told me to walk away. How on earth do you get a Narc to see there behaviour, let alone be accountable for it?

    • Kim Cooper says:

      Hi David, Narcissism is invisible to ourselves. You probably have a bit of it in you too that you cannot see! Our program is not about making a person face themselves – it is about knowing how to respond to their irresponsibility and abuse in a way that is healing for you both. This process is sometimes called re-parenting and just like parenting you do not need to explain what is wrong in an analytical way. Just like you wouldn’t tell a child they are immature and should look at themselves. Instead you set boundaries and work on your own responses and emotional intelligence. This will either have the effect of helping them in a tough love kind of way or else you will get stronger and be okay about moving on.

  29. searching for answers says:

    Hi Kim

    I am registered to your site and receiving your e-mails and always reading them very carefully. First of all I want to thank you for all your time and the help you are giving. I am planing on buying your books that can help my situation, but need help choosing and with some of my questions below.

    I am 35 years old and dating with a guy who has Narsissistic Personality Disorder or Narcissistic traits. My first question is what is the level in order to say that it is a disorder and it can not be cured? One thing I am very sure that he has very very little or no emphaty to other people. And he is really selfish in many cases. He can only be giving if he wants something in return. And if the things do not end up the way he wants he can get really rude. He smokes at least one a half pack a day and drinks at leats every other day. He can’t take any critisim and does have a big ego that makes him looks down on some of my friends. And I think he is sometimes rude and selfish to his parents and his younger brother. Sometimes, in front of the people he wants to impress he puts an act and mostly do impress them. He does not like holidays and big diners where many people and family gets together.

    However he is very attached to me and sometimes very enjoyable and loving too. And does not want to lose me. When we have a fight he does everything to please me. I do love him and he wants to get married with me soon. Because of my age and the fact that we are a minority in my country I want to get married soon with someone my religon. My parents also want me to get married with someone the same religion and unfortunatelly it is very hard to find in my country nowadays. His family are also very nice to me and wants us to get married. Everything seems perfect on paper. On the other hand I am very scared when I read all the stories of people who are married with a person with NPD. One night I tried to show him a web page about NPD symptoms but he said they have nothing to do with him. He didn’t want to accept he has the disorder. I hope I am not doing a big mistake with considering a future with him. Is there a big chance that he gets worse once we got married?

    I do not think I have any co dependency issues especially at my age now. Eventhough this was not exactly the relationship I have always dreamt of, I really want to have a home and children before it is too late. I try to relaise the difficultes I may have to face in the future. I want to know if there is way to manage them in best way and way to establish a happy relationship and a marriage with him in the future before it is too late for me to be married and especially to have children.

    I hope you can help me with answering my questions or recommending your books for my sutiation. I can buy your books when I will be back to my place in late Sept. Now I am living with my parents for a short time and do not want the risk of them relaising my purchase.

    Thank you very very much for all your support. I will be looking forward for your answer.

    • Kim Cooper says:

      I would certainly work through all of the steps in The Love Safety Net Workbook and 10 steps to overcome codependence BEFORE you get married. One way or another it will leave you in a much better situation than you are now. My advice to you is that you should tackle this before you have kids.

  30. Penelope says:

    I found your website sometime ago and have found the information so helpful, unfortunately, I found it after my relationship with my Narcissistic partner ended. We weren’t married, so I had limited contact with him when it was ending and was unable to apply any new skills I had learned from your site when it would have been most helpful. However up until last month, he had still been contacting me through texts and emails…saying he loved me, but never was there any action behind the words nor was there anything said to indicate he wanted to work on things responsibly or wanted the relationship back. I was so skeptical but I remained open and hopeful and even saw him a few times. My gut was telling me; however, to keep my distance and sensed he was involved with other women by this point and was possibly toying with me – which had happened before. He did tell me once not too long ago that he loved me and thought about me every day and that we should “talk”, I had hoped he would follow up on that, but he didn’t and I just don’t know if I’ll ever know the truth when his actions are so contradictory to his words. It’s been a year since our relationship officially ended. I have ups and downs with recovering and letting go. I really do love him and think about him daily. I wish things could have turned out differently, yet I’ve also had to hold on to how I actually felt in the relationship and know it’s something I don’t really want to repeat. I want a healthy relationship with someone who cares about my thoughts and feelings too, not just his own. It’s been a month since we’ve had contact and the last time I reached out to him he was very distant and cold which leads me to believe he’s with a new partner now or “punishing” me. I wish I had some of the tools taught by your site in my arsenol when I had the chance to make a difference. Thank you for all you have done and do. I hope my experience will one day help someone through a similar situation with a more hopeful outcome.

  31. Amy says:

    Hi Kim,

    Hi Kim,
    I had to share this with you. I just read the post you have on your website under the movies titled “Song of the male narcissist” and I have to say WOW it made me cry because that is what I see in my partner. It is as if he wrote it in his words. Very powerful! Did you write that?

  32. Tracy says:

    Google doesn’t discriminate – it’s based on data wihin your site – keywords and meta tags, plus the numebr of hits you get. You need to set your site up with the best possible Search Engine Optimisation techniques. You can also buy google spots to appear at the top of the page.
    There are many consultants out there that can help you with this. It;s not luck. It’s marketing and money combined with technology! Good luck.

    • Kim Cooper says:

      Thanks Tracy – Yes it is not luck but consultants charge a lot and give me tons of work to do which I have found usually doesn’t get much of a result. Also Adwords is very hard to make profitable when we charge so little for our books and so many of our readers do not have money to pay (because we get a lot more clicks than sales). Anyway I have given the suggestions you make my very best for 5 years and still I am losing this game. We spent 100 thousand on adwords last year and our business only made 4 and eventually we just had to turn adwords off. I have always done everything Google tell me to do changing my site which often is a full time job – then when the quality score for our main keyword is still only 3 they refuse to let me know why. Anyway I am very frustrated about this situation. We have great products and work very hard and there are so many people who need us we do not deserve to be going broke!

  33. Shelagh Wiwcharuk says:

    Hi Kim,
    Thanks for all the encouraging info. I am so done, and yet for some reason I have not left my husband. I get angry, I have and am learning how to ignore his outbursts, although not physical, very verbally abusive at times, not all the time. I have a good support system with my prayer ministers in my church, and I have asked God to open the door and I will go through if I am to leave, but somehow this just doesnot happen. I often leave and go to see my grandchildren and daughter and son, when I return home my husband seems happy for my return, but….I am tired of the roller doaster ride I travell.

  34. searching for answers says:

    So wich book(s) should I puchase? Is it “The Love Safety Net”? Is it enough? Is it the only book I need? I hope it helps because things started geting harder with him. Your book will be the last move, last try I will do and then if it does not workout I will leave. So after your reply, I will purchse it very soon. Thank you very much.

  35. Darlyn says:

    Hey searching for answers!

    I believe the comment by Kim just prior to this on of your dated Aug 29, 2012 at 6:45pm is meant for you. Here is a copy/paste of her comment:

    “I would certainly work through all of the steps in The Love Safety Net Workbook and 10 steps to overcome codependence BEFORE you get married. One way or another it will leave you in a much better situation than you are now. My advice to you is that you should tackle this before you have kids.”

    If I was in your position I would also get ‘Back From The Looking Glass’.

    Hope to hear from you again.

  36. Darlyn says:

    Hey Shelagh Wiwcharuk!

    Do you have any of Kim & Steve’s ebooks? They have updated their homepage, here is the link:

    http://www.narcissismcured.com

    Hope to hear from you again.

  37. Fae says:

    My husband is so mean to me. I cant ever finish a sentance without him interupting, he behaves so paranoid, and has so many secrets. He is a good daddy to the kids, and so I feel confussed. Do I stay? Hes already left, but wont get a divorce. Sometimes, in his eyes, I see the boy I married, the one that loves me. And that gives me hope. But mostly, he is full of blaming and pure hurt. I’m getting to the point of loosing hope. I have nightmares every night. Hes left me with 4 small kids, and says he doesnt miss them at all at times and others he is snuggled up on a visit reading board books with our daughter? My heart is SO confussed! Help! I have all the books, and am beggining to read them, bit just wanted some help from anyone out there who might be in the same spot.

  38. Darlyn says:

    Hey Fae!

    Do you have the one ’10 Steps To Overcome Co-dependence’?

    My husband and I have no small children at home any longer. So I’ll relate it to the grandchildren if you don’t mind.

    My N husband is ‘on & off’ with his feelings towards missing them or not also. It sounds that you are on the same roller coaster as the rest of us(the cycles of a narcissist-alot like our PMS although worse in my opinion).

    Should you stay? Only you know the answer to that question. Since he has already left and you have the books, start reading and put the steps in place before you make any drastic decisions. Do you have any of the self soothing material? That is very important also, to self sooth so the rational part of the brain kicks in before the emotional part.

    Is he paying you any support for the children and such? What or how are the general interactions between you and him? Do you know if he is seeing someone else? How old are the children and how are they coping with his absence?

    Hope to hear from you again soon.

  39. Marcia says:

    Struggling as my husband only communicates when he needs something – and his ex-wife is supplying, so he has no need for a real wife. He lives a hidden life overseas with a new, much younger woman. He won’t file for divorce, so I am saving until I can afford to file.

  40. Cathy Miller says:

    Hi everybody and bless you Kim and yr husband.. My husband of two yrs calls me “Dr Phyllis, so you can see how far I am from convincing him there are massive problems… I believe I am also “N”, but I have compassion and empathy – so mix in co dependence, and maybe BPD(??)( I cry all th time..)… But I cruelly left a fine husband when I met this current one at a convention 12 yrs ago…..Sounds pretty Narcissitic to me..Two “N”s in one household in a disaster and so barren at times I think I am going crazy…. I have read and re-read all of my books for self help… I am so addicted to this man I hate myself…. Working to become financially independent because that is probably my only salavation… SO very hard to think about starting over when I m 60yrs…He provided/provides us with a wonderful lifestyle, but I know he doesn’t want to be with me anymore.. Not much fun to go on vacation to Mexico and look at each other…. And as the books say, it seemed to have come undone after we wed.. We lived together for 6-7 yrs before..
    There were incidents of “strange behavior” those yrs, but I started to put pieces together, and looking up on the internet.. WOW! As you people say-”TEXTBOOK”. He will not go to a therapist – I would have to pay for it, and there is NOTHING WRONG with him !! I CAUSE him to behave the way he does…So now his excuse is he works all the time.. Never planning for “us”.. The mariagge is his last consideration…. BUT…!! And this infuriates me more than anything.. He is always TELLING me he loves me…ACK!! Just as much as he calls me a “stupid fucking bitch” when I am “naggging” or “bitching” at him…. So I don’t talk to him except when neccessary, and I really CAN’T talk to him for fearing “gaslighting” or manipulation, or I just don’t believe what he sez anymore… SOOOOO… If the ability to trust is gone, and I am paranoid about everything that goes on… Is it time to leave ?? Oh yeah he REALLY doesn’t like to be alone.. Even the TV is on all the time… OK I’ll stop rambling.. I keep a journal frequently.. Last Novembers entry was the same as todays.. WHat does THAT tell me…
    I do not like to be alone either.. I am SO hungry for touching, sex, hugs, laughter and smiles…I cam practicing my self-soothing, but hugging myself is not the same… And I can’t really kiss myself either…. Thanks everyone for the input ans support and place to VENT.. LotsoLove CathyM

    • Kim Cooper says:

      Hey Cathy – If things are the same as November maybe you need to have a look at your workbook and see what exercises you avoid. They are the ones that will probably make the biggest difference!

  41. Darlyn says:

    Hey Cathy!

    Kim is right. The exercises or issues we tend to avoid are usually the problem solvers. As well as the ones that need more attention and effort. That’s why we avoid them. They’re not simple, easy and are complex making it so much easier to avoid them.

    Hope to hear from again.

  42. margaret says:

    Hi, Kim, Steve, et al. I’ve been on here before, talking about my husband who’s a narcissist and is having a brain disease behind alot of his detachment issues: epilepsy in the temporal lobe, possible neuro-degenerative, all acting on him to make him unable to relate.

    A few weeks ago I was really onto him to admit his disease, and tell family members about the crazy abuse: it’s wrecked a lot of relationships for me, people who are very contemptuous of me now.

    He left, after I lost it and hit him with the nearest object, which happened to be a glass hurricane on an oil lamp. I was in control in that I wasn’t going to break it, and I was trying to get his attention on the abuse and the lack of admitting disease. I want him treated soon!

    Anyway, he left and got off his meds and is now untreated except for the anti-epileptic. I now feel surrounded by people who are telling me to appease him (off meds he’s paranoid and extremely controlling, everything is about his rights and
    his boundaries and his space, in spite of our having six kids, one on the way, home schooling at his insistence, and my adrenal fatigue, etc.)

    The thing I want to tell people, and want to admit, is my anger really got us off kilter. If I had been a little less angry, he’d be on meds today.

    I have a baby coming in two months, have no idea if he’ll be at the birth or be safe enough to be included, my parents think I’m a bad woman for not appeasing him, my church, my friends no doubt….and all because I was angry at his illness.

    I am not sure I could have another chance even if I had one: in other words,
    it could have happened at any point in the last twenty years of marriage. It’s all been about putting up with abnormal behavior, hoping it would improve, ignoring my kids’ needs so I can get Daddy to love me and them, just hang on a little longer and it will get better.

    Is it narcissism, is it disease? I’ll never know until it plays out. And which would I do if it’s narcissism, or disease, leave or stay? I hope I know if the time comes.

    I’m praying I will have some help in printing out the e-book and getting started working on my co-dependence, because I think my anger is scaring people and I need to get out of the feeling of being under his control fast as possible.

    In Jesus, MB

  43. Michelle says:

    I recently found your site and subscribed to your newsletter. I’ve also sent Steve a message on facebook regarding my situation. I am in the middle of major crisis with my bf who I just figured out shows nearly every sign of having NPD. He has held me hostage financially, cut me off from all of my friends and family, and turned everyone in our lives against me. I used to be a strong independent woman. He has reduced me to a shell of the person that I used to be. I can’t function in daily life anymore. I have contemplated suicide, but don’t feel it is the answer. I have left him, and now he is begging me to come back, and because of reading other sites about NPD, I decided to cut off all contact with him. I blocked my phone number, but he is still sending texts to which I have not responded. Last night he also emailed me, and said let’s get married, I love you. He also has a severe alcohol problem that has escalated recently, but I kinda feel he is using the alcohol to garner attention from others to take care of him since I have been gone. I feel the email saying lets get married is just another manipulation technique of his, and that it isn’t something that is something he really intends to do. However, I am tempted in a major way, because he took all of the money we made together and I am destitute now. In my mind, if there were a chance that we were to get married, I could legally be able to have him committed in order to get the help he needs. I also would be legally entitled to the assets that I have worked hard for, which he now possesses. I love him, and I see that hurting child. I know there is something wrong with me too, and I am willing and ready to seek the help that I need to fix me. I have always tried to help others and “fix” other people’s problems while taking a back seat to my own personal pain. I am standing here at a crossroad, and I don’t know which way to turn. Abandoning him feels wrong, but staying with him without change will lead to the death of me, I am certain of it. My health is affected, and I almost feel as if I am destroyed. I have been reading for 3 days everything I can find online about this disorder, and your site is the only one that gives hope. Everyone else says to run. I have told him that I think he has this disorder (I know I shouldn’t have done that), and he said now I think I’m a doctor. However, there are moments when he has admitted to me that he has mannipulated and controlled everyone in our business and all friends and family surrounding us. He admitted he told them all lies about me. He has admitted to holding me financially hostage. However, he would only admit it to me, no one else. He is terrified of people finding out who he really is. I sure hope someone here can give me some advice. I am struggling with what I should do. I feel so ashamed of having tolerated this abuse for as long as I have. I also will be ashamed if I go back to him. He has embarassed me and lied about me to so many people that I feel like a fool for even considering the marriage idea in the middle of this crazy drama. My friends and the people who love me want me away from him. Luckily, I still have a few left that haven’t been poisoned against me. What should I do? How can this possibly be fixed? Would marriage somehow make me equal? I doubt it. I know it would give me rights that I don’t have now, but it might also give him more power over me.

    • Kim Cooper says:

      Hi Michelle and welcome! Personally I would say something like, “Hey it is great you still love me because I love you too and I am sorry I blocked you on my phone, but after everything that has happened I didn’t know what to do.” Getting married is a fine idea but we need to build a lot more trust between us first. I want a husband who is man enough to treat his wife like his equal. I know I haven’t always acted like your equal and I that’s why I have taken some time out to work on my emotions and get stronger so I am not so emotionally dependent on you. I think I can do that and I feel very good about me getting stronger in that way. On your side I would like to see if you can start being more fair and trusting with me over our finances and not bad mouthing me to other people. You have left me with nothing and if you are genuine about loving me and wanting a partnership that is going to need to change first. I will not ever let myself become so weak and isolated as I was with you again. It was because I became so disempowered that I had to leave. I know you might feel scared that if I was stronger I might abandon you – but really it’s the other way around. You being able to treat me like your equal and with respect, and be fair about the money we made together really would make me like you so much more and want to be with you. Let’s see if we can take steps towards that okay?”

      After that you just walk away from that challenge and see if he eventually offers anything. If not I would not marry him to get your share of what he owes you. Instead I would get legal advice and do whatever you need to do to get what is yours. You don’t have to be nasty about that – just determined and firm. You NOT letting him walk all over you is the only thing that will make him respect you in the end anyway.

  44. Darlyn says:

    Hey Michelle!
    I don’t have anything I can add to what Kim wrote other than to agree with her.

    Just know that we are all here for you. Hope to hear from you again.

  45. Lucy says:

    Hi all
    New to Kim and steve’s information. A little over 12 months since finding out about my partner of 20 yrs disclosures of use of prostitutes and relationships formed with these women. We have 2 beautiful girls. To fund this habit he had been stealing from my family’s business.

    Strangely I had sense of relief, as I was able to make sense of a puzzle that I had not been able to solve . I had been aware he was unwell since we met. Knew he had a mental illness. Thought it may have been bipolar, but he was diagnosed with chronic depression. How little we new of his secret. He had gone to counselling with sexual health councillor as u gave him an ultimatum, get on a flight with the girls and i which was preplanned 10 day holiday and agree to seeing sexual health counsellor the day we got back . I realised he had a sex addiction. Like Kim I needed to understand and I researched like crazy. I meditated to stay sane on the 4 hr flight , I had never done this before.
    The girls knew as the councillor had said because if their age they needed to. No more lies.
    Although the counselling was a good starting point and support for myself my partner no surprises only went when I made the appointments, so now u only go, like Kim everyone’s advice is to cut and run. The co-dependant on me is too stubborn , we have seen vast improvement with my boundary setting, the girls added their points. No porn in the house.
    No violence after anger outbursts, the violence had been minimal but the fear was real for the girls he had never been violent to me but verbal abuse was common.
    What a light bulb moment when I stumbled across your site . OMG of course narsasstic tendencies. Made so much sense. I have made more progress personally and this all helps the girls and also a by product is helping my partner.

    I am stronger each day, I know u don’t need him, but he does need us. Looking forward to reading more of your books and articles. Thank you timing is perfect. Exited about the future where ever it takes us. The girls and I are and will be happy no matter what:)

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